17:59:07 <dondelelcaro> #startmeeting 17:59:07 <MeetBot> Meeting started Wed Jan 27 17:59:07 2016 UTC. The chair is dondelelcaro. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:59:07 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 17:59:12 <dondelelcaro> #topic Who is here? 17:59:16 <dondelelcaro> Don Armstrong 17:59:17 <hartmans> Sam Hartman 17:59:22 <keithp> Keith Packard 17:59:32 <dondelelcaro> I know that tfheen and odyx have sent regrets 17:59:53 <dondelelcaro> err, Mithrandir is the right nick. ;-) 17:59:56 <dondelelcaro> aba: ping 18:00:32 <dondelelcaro> #topic Next Meeting? 18:00:44 <dondelelcaro> currently the winner is the same time slot, which is what I've scheduled it as 18:00:54 <dondelelcaro> (well, one of the winners) 18:01:01 <dondelelcaro> if this is bad for anyone, please change your vote 18:01:15 <dondelelcaro> I'll finalize the next meeting in two weeks 18:01:22 <dondelelcaro> #action dondelelcaro to finalize next meeting in two weeks 18:01:25 <keithp> sounds good 18:01:39 <dondelelcaro> #topic #741573 Menu systems - Debian Policy followup 18:02:03 <dondelelcaro> I tried to restart this discussion, but nothing really happened, and I haven't had enough time to sit down and run through it myself 18:02:46 <hartmans> Did tdhe initial NMU ever happen? 18:02:48 <dondelelcaro> no 18:02:58 <keithp> hartmans: I don't think anything moved at all 18:03:01 <dondelelcaro> we had discussed trying to go through the usual process without an NMU 18:03:10 <dondelelcaro> but I was supposed to do an NMU if the usual process didn't occur 18:03:42 <keithp> dondelelcaro: sounds like it's time 18:03:51 <dondelelcaro> yeah, I think so 18:04:03 <dondelelcaro> do any of you object? 18:04:20 <hartmans> I certainly don't object to the NMU with the wording we clearly approved. 18:04:43 <dondelelcaro> cool. the NMU would be restricted to just introducing that wording, and nothing more 18:04:50 <hartmans> Long term if debian-policy is unwilling to take up the issue we may need to develop something for the second part, but that would take specific cycles here. 18:04:51 <keithp> of course 18:05:00 <dondelelcaro> OK 18:05:13 <dondelelcaro> I'll announce my intention to NMU, and upload to delayed/7 or similar 18:05:18 <keithp> thanks 18:05:23 <hartmans> yes, thanks 18:05:24 <dondelelcaro> #action dondelelcaro to NMU policy according to decision on menu policy 18:05:37 <dondelelcaro> that won't hapen until this weekend, I think, but I'll get on it 18:05:47 <dondelelcaro> #topic #771070 Coordinate plan and requirements for cross toolchain packages in Debian 18:05:50 <keithp> no fosdemo for you? 18:06:01 <dondelelcaro> no; I really should go one of these years 18:06:13 <dondelelcaro> working on getting three papers out right now 18:06:32 <jcristau> keithp: you'll be there? 18:06:58 <keithp> jcristau: no, austrailia instead 18:07:26 <jcristau> should be warmer 18:07:27 <dondelelcaro> with #771070, I think this is still waiting on the plan to be written up, but the current state is relatively functional 18:07:45 <dondelelcaro> I think we should probably write this up to document what happened, and then close the bug 18:07:53 <keithp> dondelelcaro: sounds like a good idea to me 18:08:24 <dondelelcaro> IE, this issue was presented to the CTTE, we mediated, and stakeholders have come up with a plan which they will communicate 18:08:48 <keithp> seems like a short note on the bug and then just closing it would suffice 18:08:53 <dondelelcaro> yeah 18:09:13 <dondelelcaro> well, I'd rather put it together as a statement and vote on it 18:09:21 <dondelelcaro> but it'll effectively be the same 18:09:30 <dondelelcaro> (since statements are non-binding) 18:09:47 <dondelelcaro> hartmans: does that work for you, too? 18:10:14 <hartmans> I don't object; I'm not convinced we need to vote on it, but that may become obvious when you get text. 18:10:36 <dondelelcaro> #topic #802159 New OpenSSL upstream version 18:10:43 <dondelelcaro> the SRMs are looking at this 18:10:55 <dondelelcaro> I don't think we need to do anything here 18:11:16 <hartmans> Shall we close offering that if anyone wants us to take specific action they can reopen? 18:11:27 <dondelelcaro> sounds good to me 18:11:44 <dondelelcaro> hartmans: would you take care of that? 18:11:52 <hartmans> sure action me please 18:12:03 <keithp> awesome 18:12:06 <dondelelcaro> #action hartmans to close #802159 offering to take specific action if someone reopens it 18:12:14 <dondelelcaro> #topic #797533 New CTTE members 18:12:30 <hartmans> I sent out mail--sorry about the delay. 18:12:36 <dondelelcaro> no problem; glad that it got started 18:12:51 <hartmans> I am really uncomfortable that we're making a decision with basically a sentence to a paragraph of support for an appointment. 18:12:54 <dondelelcaro> I think I should send out an e-mail to d-d-a indicating that we've got the nominees and are deliberating 18:13:18 <hartmans> That said, I don't know how to get from where we are to somewhere useful. 18:13:33 <hartmans> I did ask a couple of questions, but I'm not sure that really gives us much more. 18:13:56 <keithp> hartmans: do you want some kind of interview process for each candidate? 18:14:04 <hartmans> I suspect that the process this year is as good as previous processes. 18:14:11 <dondelelcaro> hartmans: I personally am not; I'm weighing much more heavily how people have behaved on mailing lists and in bug reports and similar 18:14:49 <hartmans> Yes, there're fairly big problems with that from a diversity problem. 18:14:55 <dondelelcaro> that tells me much more about their technical thinking and how they interact than anything they could say in an interview or in response to CTTE questions 18:15:09 <hartmans> If you're mostly making a decision based on your personal observations, then you can only select people you know, or they have a huge advantage. 18:15:22 <hartmans> That tends to be bad for the organization long-term. 18:15:43 <dondelelcaro> hartmans: that's true; I'm certianly open to additional information gathering 18:15:53 <keithp> hartmans: not personal observations, but the whole recorded history of interactions with the project 18:16:04 <hartmans> But yes, I do have that sort of information on the nominees we have, and if that's what I have, it's certainly what I'll use. 18:16:39 <hartmans> keithp: Do you have confidence in your tools for finding and reviewing that? Would you be willing to write up a summary of what you've done and what you found? 18:17:10 <hartmans> Because yes, we do have history and if we've actually gone through a significant chunk of it, rather than basing on our memories, then that would be good. 18:17:13 <keithp> hartmans: nothing more than google, I'm afraid 18:17:33 <dondelelcaro> why don't we all write up a brief summary of the interactions we've noted for each candidate? 18:17:36 <hartmans> OK, but you have googled the nominees and gone through a significant chunk of their approaches/messages? 18:17:41 <hartmans> That would be a very valuable writup 18:18:06 <dondelelcaro> that way it's not being put on a single person, and we hopefully will find different things 18:18:07 <keithp> hartmans: I'll try to recreate it and write it up 18:18:27 <hartmans> don: sounds good. I'll certainly write up what I have. 18:18:49 <dondelelcaro> lets try to get those writeups done in the next three weeks 18:19:11 <dondelelcaro> #action everyone to write up information on each of the nominees to present to the -private mailing list 18:19:33 <dondelelcaro> #action dondelelcaro to thank nominees in a d-d-a announcement without mentioning them by name 18:19:43 <dondelelcaro> #topic Additional Business 18:20:41 <dondelelcaro> anything else? 18:21:12 <keithp> three bugs closed in one meeting? Has to be a record... 18:21:50 <dondelelcaro> yeah; if we get them closed, we'll only have the new members open, which will be great 18:22:36 <keithp> good place to have new members join 18:22:58 <dondelelcaro> yep 18:23:16 <hartmans> nod 18:23:21 * hartmans is closing now 18:23:33 <dondelelcaro> ok; I'll stop here 18:23:35 <dondelelcaro> #endmeeting