18:57:59 <sysrqb> #startmeeting Tor Browser meeting 8 February 2021
18:57:59 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Feb  8 18:57:59 2021 UTC.  The chair is sysrqb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:57:59 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
18:58:20 <sysrqb> Pad: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-tbb-keep
18:58:24 <GeKo> hi!
18:59:12 <dunqan> hey hey 0/
18:59:15 <acat> o/
18:59:18 <dunqan> *o/
19:03:21 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> Hello!
19:03:29 <sysrqb> o/
19:04:18 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> (apologies for missing the last meeting, things were a bit hectic here)
19:05:48 <sysrqb> no worries
19:06:03 <sysrqb> things rae a bit hectic around here, too :)
19:06:06 <sysrqb> *are
19:06:53 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> heh, so much for hecticness disappearing with 2020...
19:07:26 <sysrqb> yes, the i was promised a do-over when 2021 arrived
19:07:48 <sysrqb> but the world didn't reset at (any) midnight on new years day
19:08:38 <sysrqb> okay
19:09:05 <sysrqb> and, with that, we are at the beginning of a new week
19:09:53 <sysrqb> reminder: please update your boards (if needed)
19:10:02 <sysrqb> https://gitlab.torproject.org/groups/tpo/applications/-/boards
19:12:55 <sysrqb> acat: did you try running the instrumented tests using the newer openjdk version?
19:13:48 <acat> in the build machine? the blocker was not having enough space
19:14:09 <sysrqb> ah
19:14:14 <sysrqb> yeah
19:14:30 <GeKo> that should be solved now, no?
19:14:31 <acat> it was fixed, i'll try this week
19:14:33 <acat> yes
19:14:36 <acat> https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/tpa/team/-/issues/40158
19:14:43 <sysrqb> okay, great
19:14:55 <sysrqb> i have a feeling we need openjdk-8
19:15:08 <sysrqb> but i am interested to learn that I'm wrong
19:15:56 <acat> hrm, might be. i recall having some problems with newer openjdk in android at some point
19:15:59 <acat> but we'll see
19:16:05 <sysrqb> yeah
19:17:10 <sysrqb> i had some problems with the signing tools when using a newer openjdk version
19:17:36 <sysrqb> but, hopefully, the testing framework is more up to date
19:18:39 <sysrqb> GeKo: acat: i'm not sure who has a better understanding for this, but are there any remaining blockers for moving Linux nightly onto FF86?
19:18:44 <sysrqb> is tor-launcher#40004 still a blocker?
19:19:04 <GeKo> no and yes
19:19:09 <sysrqb> oh, good
19:19:24 <GeKo> well, from a build side we are good
19:19:34 <sysrqb> oh, i see
19:19:38 <GeKo> (to make that "no" and "yes" explicit)
19:19:44 <sysrqb> yes, that bug is still a blocker
19:19:50 <sysrqb> yeah, okay. i understand now
19:19:54 <GeKo> yep
19:20:00 <GeKo> but that's the only one
19:20:11 <sysrqb> "only" :)
19:20:22 <GeKo> that whole change including torbutton#40027 makes me nervous
19:20:39 <GeKo> but i guess we need to cross that brídge at some point
19:21:20 <sysrqb> yeah, and the sooner we get it into nightly, the sooner we start finding bugs
19:22:04 <sysrqb> but, we'll need it in a couple months, no matter what
19:22:49 <GeKo> yep
19:23:36 <sysrqb> acat: do you want to talk about the cryptocurrency patch?
19:23:44 * sysrqb wonders if sanketh is around, too
19:24:12 <sanketh> Hey!
19:24:20 <sysrqb> hi!
19:24:24 <acat> well, just to decide how to proceed. i think from technical point of view it's merge ready
19:24:33 <sysrqb> tor-browser#40209
19:25:29 <sanketh> gah, I missed the email about it being accepted. I can squash it and re-upload a patch in a few hours.
19:25:58 <acat> sanketh: no problem
19:26:07 <sysrqb> sanketh: GitLab says this is your 1st Contribution, congrats :)
19:26:27 <sanketh> Haha, thanks!
19:26:29 <sysrqb> i'm hapy with landing this in nightly and letting it bake for a bit
19:26:39 <sysrqb> *happy
19:27:17 <acat> so, would that be a patch that we apply in tor-browser-build?
19:27:22 <sysrqb> i think the easiest way is by taking it as a patch, and then applying it in tor-browser-build
19:27:27 <acat> ok :)
19:27:29 <sysrqb> yeah, that's my thought (too)
19:28:32 <GeKo> uhm, why?
19:29:07 <sysrqb> unless we add a pref for it
19:29:15 <GeKo> i am not a huge fan of making tor-browser-build more complex
19:29:20 <GeKo> if it can be avoided
19:29:23 <sysrqb> i know :)
19:29:30 <sysrqb> and i agree
19:29:31 <GeKo> it's already a beast
19:29:53 <sysrqb> but i don't know if there's an easy way this new thing can be disabled by in alphas
19:29:56 <sysrqb> i guess.
19:29:57 <sanketh> There is a pref for it.
19:29:59 <GeKo> is the reasoning that it might not be ready for the next alpha
19:30:01 <GeKo> ?
19:30:07 <sysrqb> yes
19:30:15 <sysrqb> sanketh: okay, great
19:30:18 <sysrqb> that was my next question
19:30:38 <acat> ah, true
19:30:49 <sysrqb> if it lands this week
19:30:50 <GeKo> if we want to ship it in stable, like 10.5
19:31:05 <GeKo> then it think its preferable that this makes it into alpha
19:31:10 <GeKo> the sooner the better
19:31:16 <sysrqb> then it'll bake for ~1.5 weeks before the next alpha
19:31:26 <GeKo> i mean sure, some days baking time on nightly
19:31:38 <GeKo> but i bet the nightly users are... not many
19:31:53 <GeKo> given that we already do not have many alpha users
19:31:56 <sysrqb> yep
19:32:10 <GeKo> so i suspect we won't get much out of having this a couple of weeks nightly only
19:32:29 <sysrqb> that's fair
19:33:32 <sysrqb> sanketh: okay, if you can rebase your patch onto 78.7.1esr, then we can land it this week and start testing it
19:34:01 <sysrqb> thanks for all of the time you put into it
19:34:26 <sanketh> sysrqb: sounds good. I have a meeting at 3, I can do it right after.
19:34:39 <sysrqb> no worries
19:34:40 <sysrqb> thanks
19:34:54 <sysrqb> acat: and thanks for reviewing it
19:35:52 <sysrqb> the only other item I have for discussion is torbutton#40026
19:35:52 <acat> a please, good work :)
19:35:56 <acat> *pleasure
19:36:03 <sysrqb> :)
19:36:18 <sysrqb> regarding localization
19:36:29 <sysrqb> dunqan: and I discussed it briefly earlier today
19:36:41 <sysrqb> the survey will only be available in English
19:37:15 <sysrqb> so, in Tor Browser, we are deciding if the banner should only be shown in the English locale
19:37:17 <sanketh> Yep, thanks acat, dunqan, sysrqb, and tjr for the reviews and the design direction! Wouldn't have been possible without y'all.
19:37:28 <dunqan> yw! thanks sanketh!
19:37:38 <sysrqb> or if it should be shown for every locale, but only in English
19:38:04 <acat> sanketh: yw!
19:38:06 <sysrqb> or, we could localize the text and show it, localized, for everyone, but then the survey is still only in English
19:38:54 <GeKo> i've no preference
19:38:56 <sysrqb> the easy answer is "show everyone the english text in the banner"
19:38:56 <dunqan> yes, so essentially it's a choice between having an English banner and link to the survey on about:tor in all locals to increase our sample size but risk confusing non-English readers, or only deploy our English banners to EN versions to mitigate that
19:40:56 <sysrqb> acat: do you have a preference?
19:41:22 <dunqan> and although our target audience for the research is essentially global, our priority are users in the global south as per sponsor 9
19:42:08 <acat> hrm, so the target is global south but the survey is not localized?
19:42:22 <sysrqb> yeah. i see.
19:42:40 <dunqan> yes, it's a bit of a contradiction but is due to capacity issues – I'm hoping we can localize later iterations of the survey
19:42:51 <acat> ok, i see
19:42:52 <dunqan> this is a sort-of pilot
19:43:40 <acat> then maybe  we could localize the text, if there are plans to localize the survey at some point
19:43:53 <dunqan> we're planning on having two surveys running in parallel: a general UX one linked to from TB-stable, and a snowflake one linked to from TB-alpha
19:44:03 <dunqan> <+acat> then maybe  we could localize the text, if there are plans to localize the survey at some point <- yep that's my hope
19:44:51 <dunqan> we're also going to be asking the comms & community teams for their input on this point too :)
19:45:18 <sysrqb> there is the annoying (technical) localization problem for the 10.0 series
19:45:48 <sysrqb> but I can manually copy new localized text, when that's needed
19:46:19 <sysrqb> but, because the survey won't be localized, I'm leaning towrad not localizing the banner's text, right now
19:46:37 <sysrqb> mostly because it's simpler
19:47:11 <acat> sysrqb: and show it only in english versions, or all?
19:47:28 <sysrqb> but, if we think localizing the text will make a significant difference in the outcome of this survey, then we can localize it
19:47:31 <sysrqb> acat: all
19:47:42 <dunqan> sysrqb: also it's worth saying that even though the two studies are going to run in parallel for the english pilot, that won't necessarily be the case for future iterations
19:48:05 <sysrqb> dunqan: yeah, that's totlaly fine
19:48:19 <sysrqb> the implementations in the two version will be separate
19:48:26 <dunqan> great, ty
19:50:09 <sysrqb> okay, i don't hear anyone having strong feelings about this
19:50:24 <dunqan> yeah np, I'll see what the other groups say
19:50:37 <sysrqb> thanks
19:50:41 <dunqan> thanks all!
19:51:56 <sysrqb> the last semi-discussion point is that currently I have 10.5a11 scheduled on Friday for Android
19:52:51 <sysrqb> if we don't receive any reports about issues from 10.5a9, then I may cancel that plan
19:53:31 <sysrqb> unless we need to test any changes for 86 before next week
19:53:53 <GeKo> next week is release building anyway, might make sense
19:54:09 <GeKo> i guess ideally we would test changes in the second alpha that result from things we need to patch
19:54:11 <sysrqb> I have the GV/MozAC changelogs on my list for this week
19:54:22 <GeKo> due to code audit/closed buug audit
19:54:27 <GeKo> *bug
19:54:27 <sysrqb> GeKo: yeah
19:54:40 <GeKo> are all of those pieces distributed yet?
19:54:49 <GeKo> i saw you assigned some tickets to you today
19:54:56 <sysrqb> acat: oh, do you have on your rdar reviewing closed tickets and dev notes for 86?
19:55:04 <GeKo> so maybe we get something we want to fix and test before we ship stable
19:55:17 <acat> i was going to ask about that, i can take those yes
19:55:25 <GeKo> but having an alpha just for an alpha's sake does indeed not  make much sense :)
19:55:37 <sysrqb> GeKo: yes, now they are distributed
19:55:43 <GeKo> it's not that releases are scarce these days
19:55:49 <GeKo> hah, that's been fast :)
19:55:50 <sysrqb> yeah, that's my thought, too
19:56:16 <sysrqb> i am okay with not adding an extra build-publish cycle
19:56:51 <sysrqb> okay, on that note
19:56:57 <sysrqb> have a nice week everyone
19:57:22 <acat> thanks!
19:57:29 <sysrqb> o/
19:57:30 <sysrqb> #endmeeting