15:59:13 <donuts> #startmeeting UX Team Weekly Meeting
15:59:13 <MeetBot> Meeting started Tue Aug 16 15:59:13 2022 UTC.  The chair is donuts. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:59:13 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
15:59:15 <championquizzer> hello! o/
15:59:19 <donuts> hola o/
15:59:24 <nah> o/
15:59:32 <donuts> welcome welcome
15:59:43 <donuts> please add anything you'd like to discuss today to the agenda: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-ux-team-2022-keep
16:00:21 <donuts> I don't have any announcements this week, so I think we can skip straight to filling out the weekly planning section too :)
16:03:02 <donuts> i think it's just the three of us today too
16:03:48 <nah> i'm done
16:04:19 <championquizzer> done
16:04:37 <donuts> great, two secs...
16:05:07 <donuts> Nah! you have a bold item!
16:05:13 <donuts> "review User Research data policy"
16:05:24 <nah> yes
16:05:27 <nah> just wanted to share
16:05:33 <nah> i got my eyes on https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/tpa/team/-/issues/40857
16:05:48 <nah> and we're discussing sharing our limesurvey instance with tails
16:06:18 <nah> that can also mean merging data policy -- it will really depend on limesurvey possibility of restricting access to some surveys or not
16:06:29 <nah> anyway
16:06:43 <nah> i realized it is good to review the user research data policy
16:06:58 <nah> not only for surveys, but to all process so i'll be working on this this week
16:07:14 <nah> and if any of you have any suggestions or reading to share, i appreciate it :)
16:07:28 * donuts is checking out the ticket...
16:09:38 <donuts> okay, thanks for bringing up those points in the ticket nah
16:10:26 <donuts> So is your thinking that we'll need to combine data policies IF we can't limit access to one-another's surveys?
16:10:37 <donuts> otherwise we could keep separate data policies, correct?
16:11:06 <nah> if we can't control which organization can see which data, yes
16:11:09 <donuts> I wonder if GDPR or similar legislation needs taken into consideration too
16:11:26 <nah> yes! i thinking about that too
16:12:03 <nah> and this only about surveys. so i'm also thinking about a data policy that can be add to our webpage on the community portal, and shared with partner organizations that are collecting feedback
16:12:13 <donuts> I think we should discuss this with some higher-ups before TPA does anything
16:12:26 <nah> and any other volunteer that runs user research
16:12:42 <donuts> right
16:12:43 <nah> yep, i think this a good idea. i was wondering the same
16:13:45 <nah> thanks donuts
16:14:17 <nah> that reminds me [off-topic] that you asked to be reminded to talk about the tor meeting
16:14:24 <donuts> so in terms of next steps, are we waiting on TPA to confirm whether or not Tails' surveys can be easily walled off?
16:14:43 <donuts> ah yes I did! well remembered :)
16:14:48 <donuts> HOWEVER
16:14:55 <donuts> I spotted that it's been added to the agenda for the All Hands tomorrow instead
16:15:25 <donuts> so let's attend that session first, and we can discuss any UX team meetings afterwards
16:15:43 <nah> cool! makes sense.
16:15:55 <nah> in terms of next steps,
16:16:06 <nah> https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/tpa/team/-/issues/40857#note_2828014
16:16:49 <nah> tails suggested to us to discuss how do we handle data policy
16:17:27 <donuts> right, but that depends on whether or not our data will be accessible by tails and vice versa first – no?
16:17:30 <nah> and my wonder is still if: (1) is it possible that tails only access tails data and tor only access tor data? otherwise (2) will we need to merge our data policy?
16:17:33 <nah> yes
16:17:44 <nah> so, waiting for this to be clarified
16:17:49 <donuts> gotcha
16:17:51 <donuts> okay cool
16:18:28 <donuts> this could be complicated by admin powers actually
16:18:48 <donuts> presumably even if we could do user groups with limited access, admins would still be able to access the whole thing
16:19:02 <donuts> so either way, a torproject person would theoretically be able to access tails data
16:19:21 <nah> yep
16:19:24 <donuts> i guess that's no different from any cloud-hosted survey provider though
16:19:30 <donuts> it's just that TPA becomes the host instead
16:19:53 <donuts> yep I see how this is complicated now 😅
16:19:59 <nah> so, we might not need to change our data policy, but they would need to mention tor access
16:20:11 <donuts> yeah potentially
16:20:30 <donuts> or that it's hosted and maintained by the Tor Project, at least
16:20:56 <donuts> who may access data as part of their regular maintenance etc. etc.
16:21:02 <nah> yep
16:22:03 <nah> i say we wait to see if it's possible to restrict some access in a way that only one data policy has to be modified?
16:22:15 <donuts> yeah I think we should wait for now
16:22:20 <nah> and then bring this up to discussion potentially in the next meeting again
16:22:26 <donuts> yesss that would be perfect, thank you nah
16:22:35 <nah> thank you!
16:22:46 <nah> in the meantime i'll work on the remaining data policy
16:22:54 <donuts> sounds great, ty!
16:23:19 <donuts> okay champion of quizzes, it's over to you I think :)
16:23:22 <donuts> ^ championquizzer
16:23:25 <nah> haha
16:23:28 <championquizzer> ha
16:23:48 <championquizzer> last week we soft launched our user support channel on signal!
16:24:15 <championquizzer> this is integrated with cdr.link (the one we have Telegram support channel on)
16:24:20 <donuts> i saw! that's awesome!
16:24:40 <championquizzer> we have got some good responses and plan soon to make a more public launch
16:24:59 <championquizzer> i.e add it to the help docs, make a public call, etc.
16:25:10 <donuts> great!
16:25:27 <nah> yay \o/
16:26:06 <championquizzer> on user support front, there's a massive uptick in private bridge requests
16:26:21 <championquizzer> mostly from users in .tm and .cn
16:26:48 <donuts> it's a shame we can't have a name/profile image on the signal channel, hopefully that's somethign that gets added to cdr.link in future
16:27:29 <championquizzer> donuts: yep, we discussed this with the folks who are hosting this instance for us
16:27:35 <donuts> oh great! what did they say?
16:28:24 <championquizzer> i think it would require some changes on their front, but should be possible
16:28:49 <nah> championquizzer: does this also indicates an increase of users in the region? or any other particular reason?
16:29:01 <nah> re: bridge requests
16:29:38 <championquizzer> nah: i am not particularly sure and the reason why i wanted to discuss. from users in china i am getting the feedback that the bridges we share are working
16:29:45 <championquizzer> in .tm that's not the case
16:30:33 <championquizzer> another line of thought is that most users are (maybe?) on outdated versions of TB hence not using Connection Assist
16:30:37 <nah> championquizzer: like the first time they try to connect using connection assist and it doesn't work and then they contact for private bridges?
16:30:44 <nah> hmmmm
16:31:17 <championquizzer> nah: yep, i haven't received a single one where they mentioned about CA..hence my assumption they might not be using Tb 11.5+
16:31:18 <nah> i wonder if when it takes long to identify the connection trouble users might assume it's not working and request new bridges
16:31:56 <nah> is it possible to ask them if they tried to use connection assist?
16:32:02 <nah> it would be useful to know it
16:32:09 <championquizzer> absolutely
16:32:33 <nah> perfect! thank you, championquizzer!
16:33:53 <championquizzer> i am planning to add short instruction on how to check whether they have up-to-date TB, if not how to update and to check with CA for these users
16:34:13 <championquizzer> will report with any feedback i can gather!
16:34:16 <donuts> btw championquizzer, a request for a Galaxy S22 has been submitted so the devs can debug that issue next :)
16:34:23 <championquizzer> awesome
16:34:35 <nah> also wanted to check something else with you, championquizzer
16:34:41 <championquizzer> sure
16:34:44 <nah> we've received some feedback from training sessions
16:34:51 <nah> Tor Browser failed to open on two laptops after successfully installing it. The two
16:34:54 <nah> laptops are Acer running Windows 7 Ultimate 32 bit and Dell Inspiron running
16:34:57 <nah> Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit.
16:35:14 <nah> have you seen this before?
16:35:53 <nah> i'm going to contact the trainer when the meeting ends to get more info as well
16:36:01 <championquizzer> hrm. Windows 7 support is a bit tricky in my experience. For some users TB is reported to work on Win7 but we get some reports from time to time of that not being the case
16:36:19 <championquizzer> Firefox ESR supports Win 7 fwiw
16:36:29 <championquizzer> so technically TB should as well, i think
16:36:37 <nah> got it.
16:36:42 <championquizzer> https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/91.11.0/system-requirements/
16:36:59 <nah> we were wondering if it was a proxy problems because they also had some failures with onion share and orbot
16:37:08 <championquizzer> nah: did they share what error messages they saw (if any)?
16:37:28 <nah> the report: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/community/training/-/issues/61#note_2827740
16:37:53 <nah> championquizzer: nop! just shared that it failed to "open" (both tor browser, orbot and onionshare)
16:38:39 <championquizzer> i see
16:39:37 <nah> that's why i'm guessing internet connectivity or proxy problems
16:39:40 <nah> i'll try to get more info
16:40:06 <nah> ty, championquizzer!
16:40:19 <championquizzer> very likely, yes
16:40:26 <championquizzer> and thank *you* nah!
16:40:57 <championquizzer> that's all from me. thanks both!
16:41:21 <donuts> great, tysm championquizzer!
16:41:26 <donuts> okay I think we're all done for today
16:41:32 <donuts> shall I close up the shop?
16:41:54 <nah> yep, thank you donuts!
16:42:07 <championquizzer> have a good week!
16:42:14 <donuts> yep, have a good week both!
16:42:15 <donuts> #endmeeting